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Posted 12 March 2011 - 09:48 PM

I'm here SH Mike. All I can say is here we go again. I find the name behind KT most interesting and I'll try to see what I can find. I always felt that the company behind the KT trademark is the key to the Lilliput dating. Lilliput has two trade marks-both KT and CK. CK(Kuramochi Shoten)was the largest supplier of made in Japen toys prior to WWII. Two of their main employees fearing the companies demise after WWII left to form Normura and Alps. From thereon they became a tier two company. KT is far more interesting in that I have only seen their trade mark on pre WWII toys. Usually in conjuction with another trademark such as Masudaya.(my guess is that KT was a manufacturer much like metal house) Now did Volkers friend only asume that KT stands for Kuramochi because that is the trade mark on the toy itself. You see one would have to have seen a box with an endflap to have seen the CK trademark. So I am still not convinced that KT stands for Kuramochi. One day I'll consult the Japanese consulate to see what info they have on the company KT. If KT did not survive past WWII-we will know that Lilliput is first. This is all just snipets of info and there is still not enough hard evidence although nothing would suprise me at this point.
The 210 patent number in 1949 makes great sense. The original Japanese patent dating system was based on the # of years from the death of emperor Hirohito or the beginning of the Showa period which I believe is 1927.

Steve, its not the number of years from the DEATH of the emperor, but the year of his REIGN. 1926 is the year Hiro Hito came to the emperorship ie year one. S= Showa , the dynasty, and S 24= 1949. BUT is 210 /1949 a JAPANESE patent application? 210 was applied for by Mr Mojinme.

#130 steve


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Posted 12 March 2011 - 10:39 PM

You are correct JRROBOTMAN - welcome to the board. At this time I simply have no hard evidence to answer your question.

#131 Brian..


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Posted 12 March 2012 - 10:49 AM

From the database:

Tin windup robot. Advances with shuffling motion via spikes under his feet that alternately move. (Pin feet) Free swinging arms have claw hands. The lower part of each arm is a separate unit shoved in to the upper arm. This fragile connection means that the lower arm is frequently missing. Lilliput is believed to be the first mass produced robot. The box carries the two logos KT and CK. Speculatively KT is the manufacturer and CK the distributor. There are two distinct versions of the robot: the difference is that the (presumably first) has a dial that is mounted in a hole in the chest with small tabs; the (later) version has a clockface stamped into the metal with titho clockface. It is assumed that the simpler version is the later; the manufacturer had presumably found a way of stamping the clock depression that would not damage the litho dial.

The design is very similar to the Atomic Robot Man (which has been firmly dated to at least 1949 and self-evidently later than 1945). The Lilliput, however, is a pre-war robot and as such is the first. The Japanese tin toy industry was well-eastablished in the 1930s. Production stopped in 1938 when toy factories switched to war production. The industry did not restart until 1946.

CK (Kuramochi Shoten) was the largest supplier of made in Japan toys prior to WWII. Two of their main employees fearing the companies demise after WWII left to form Normura and Alps. KT (possibly Kuramochi Toys) is a trade mark that is invariably seen on pre WWII toys, usually in conjuction with another trademark such as Masudaya. The manufacturer Komatsudo Seisakusho has also been mentioned, but the information needs clarifying.

Recently Volker tracked down a Nurnberg museum with a Lilliput bearing a trade sample import label dated 2/7/1937. The Liliput had come out the Schuco Toy Company archive. Shuco had ordered this Robot in 1937 for " Benchmarking " When Schuco closed their doors in the 1970s some items from their archive found their way into the museum.

Henk Gosses recalls a small warehouse find of these robots: "The seller brought about a dozen with him,- later versions, and said he had many more. It was a stock discovery and he showed an invoice from 1939 to an importer in Antwerp. Later Pierre Boogaerts bought the last 6-7 and told him how much he would pay for the rest. The seller became very mysterious and in spite of my vailliant efforts, I never heart from him again."

The rule of Emperor Hirohito (Showa dynasty) began in 1926. Japanese dates were calculated using this starting point. A patent number on the robot suggests the 10th year of the Emperor's reign: 1936. The box art is stylistically 1930s, though this is clearly a subjective judgement. An original owner appeared on the "Antiques Roadshow" with a collection of toys, all pre-war, which included the Lilliput. He was able to recall receiving it as a child before the war. Again, not conclusive proof but a strong circumstantial case. It should be added that some believe this to be a post war toy based on or the forerunner of the Atomic Robot Man. Pin-foot 15cm

Brian Hayes